Hi,
A website with 2 parts: navigation links left and content right.
There are some possibilities to make that, and I need some pro's and contra's to know in wich way i'm going to build that website.
- All in frames
- All in tables
- All in Div's
- With Iframes
Or other options, or combined? It's with some photoshopped graphics around in background etc.
How would you make it?
What's the best thing, compatible with most browsers, most flexible, combining with css. Which is web standard and political correct. Pro & contra?

How do you guys do that?

NO tables! lol

Definitely use divs, they are sooo much better than tables.

Frames are sort of a different thing to tables and divs, so you could use both if you like, but I'd suggest you don't - frames aren't that popular any more.

Hope that helps

Web standard = HTML and CSS, NO TABLES for layout, NO frames or iFrames, and semantic, validated code.

I agree 100%... HTML and CSS. If you dont know CSS its definatly worth the time to learn. It will save you alot of time in the end.

Ok, thnx.

But what about sites like these: http://ed.myprayerbeads.org/
Those have beautiful layout, but full of tables.

I'm working on a design for a site, and I'm actually a little bit stuck. It's with backgrounds i'm making in photoshop. And those images are nested in tables around the place where the content needs to come. The open space where the content comes is in a table... so i need to put iframes in that one because otherwise i can't switch content in it easily.
But it's not so easy to do all those stuff i guess... so i thought, with DIV's and CSS i could manage... but i just don't know how. I'm not so good at CSS and don't know much from divs and spans etc...

I've seen on the link above that those people can make such websites in div too. But i'm going to see later how they manage that in html. But i read it's much more difficult to make those design structures in div's. I guess they also use tables to align everything properly?
I'm going to download such previews this evening and study. If i have questions i'll come around ;-)

You can do the exact same thing with CSS. Once you know how to use CSS it is alot easier and more efficient. My guess would have to be that the specific site you refered to was created a while ago when CSS was still in early stages and/or the designer does not have time to redesign it. Style sheets can do everything tables can and more! Great tutorials here: http://www.w3schools.com/css/

Originally Posted by cbeaudin

Great tutorials here: http://www.w3schools.com/css/

It's hilarious that this site is full of tables... tables with css included.

But i read it's much more difficult to make those design structures in div's.

No, it isn't harder, probably EASIER. However, you DO have to take the time to learn.

I guess they also use tables to align everything properly?

Absolutely NOT !!! CSS can do it all. As for your example site, I can do all that without a single table. If you want to see what CAN be done with CSS, go take a cruise around www.csszengarden.com.

Originally Posted by Bulevardi

I guess they also use tables to align everything properly?

LOL


I wonder why half the postings in HTML forums are about how to fix alignments in table layouts.

Thnx. I'm going to read a bit about that.
The only problem is that I don't have the time anymore (like everyone).
Those css stuff can be very handy if you like to change things in layout, often.
But if you just have a still layout for long time, and you only have to make some small changes sometimes in the content without changing layout stuff, you can do it with one simple design, no?

I've been looking at lots of sites and I still have seen much pretty sites in tables, frames etc...
Actually, it's all for the visitors and users that we make websites.
Visitors DON'T see that it's made in tables or div's. It's only usefull for the maker of the site.

I'm going to make the website first in tables (cause it's almost finished) and than in div's. Just to learn how those things work.

But, there are a little few things about div's. Most div sites put their navigation and content in one page. All content pages with the navigationlinks in the same .html file.
So if they have to change one single link in the navigation, all the content pages have to change! It's NOT well done, isn't it. If you have frames for your navigation, you just have to change it for one page.
So maybe it's better to use frames for you navigation + div's in the content. Or PHP, most flexible for content.
Those div's are good for changing easily your style/design... but NOT better for content. And if you make one design and you keep it like that, than there is no need for div's. Only when you change your style frequently it's usefull.

This is how it is. The first time you use XHTML+CSS it is pretty hard, it seems like there's so many options, and then all the selectors, etc. Kind of overwhelming at first, but like with all good things, the more you do it, the more fun you can have with it.
That's why I'd recommend to scrap the tables all together and just use XHTML+CSS straight away, otherwise you might be lured back to the dark side of the web.