I'm sure we've all been through similar situations, where you're working on a project and your client will nitpick at little things, or has big ideas of their own that you know just aren't a smart idea...You know this because of your history in web site development. You have your ideas of what looks good, and have an understanding of what it takes to get to that point of looking good and functioning. Then, the person that you're doing the work for comes along and busts your bubble with their crappy ideas.

"Make this text blue...yeah i know the background is bright red, but i think it looks cool"

We know better than to do something silly like that...but they don't.

I think some of the crappy web sites that get turned out now days aren't necessarily the work of some crappy web designers, rather, it's the work of a web designer that knows what he's doing and making his client happy, even if his client is happy with complete crap.

Perhaps this is a rant of what's happened to me today. My boss has these big ideas of a flash loaded web site, and I couldn't disagree more. I don't care for a flash loaded web site...he wants products flying in and words flying around and doing all this crazy stuff, and there's not much I can do but do the work. I was initially very excited about the work that I had done...it was completely CSS and HTML validated, and it was a crisp and clean site made completely with CSS. He looks at it and says "OK, can we do this to it"...and we proceed to start putting in flash elements and changing the color scheme and all this other junk that just doesn't appeal to me...and now i'm losing all interest in proceeding....but, I will because i'm on his time.


So my question to you more experienced web developers is, How do you deal with this type of client? One of the obvious answers is to say "OK, well that's going to cost you $xxx.xx"...I wish that was an option for me...the company I work for is not a web site company, but a manufacturer of products...I'm on a wage, and can't necessarily ask for more money because it's a web site.

I would appreciate your thoughts.

I'm lucky, since I do freelance work and I simply refuse to do anything that compromises accessibility, standards and good taste. Usually a quick lesson to the client solves it.

And I have it written into my default client agreement that on my part I won't do anything that I consider to be unethical in the field of web developments.

Jamie

Originally Posted by JamieLewis

And I have it written into my default client agreement that on my part I won't do anything that I consider to be unethical in the field of web developments.

Such as?

Writing markup that is unstandardised or inaccessible. Building any features into a site that makes the default functions of the site unusable. Generally touching flash. Not testing the site in a multitude of browsers. Adding content that I consider to be spam or keyword stuffed. Working on any site where I deem the content to be useless (I am pretty open to most things but I refuse to touch religious, marketting and copycat sites).

Jamie

I'm in Jamie's boat. If I know it won't work, I generally don't back down. The only exceptions I make are when clients give me multiple sites (as in 10 or more) and they've already heard my stances on various issues. Most of my client's employees now say "Adam, we know you think it's wrong, we know why you think it's wrong, we think it's wrong, but we're not in a position to negotiate." If only because my client's *** is on the line and not my own, then I do it.

So my question to you more experienced web developers is, How do you deal with this type of client?

Not a great web designer. I do have 40 years of dealing with the "purchasing" public. You suck it up and take your check. Later in life if you work hard and save you can do what you want.

Edit: Just decline to put your name on anything that does not meet your standards. Say I will do it but I don't want a credit. That is not going to do you any good in your current situation. It might help you in the future.

Edit: Just decline to put your name on anything that does not meet your standards.

That's precisely what I do -- but if I don't have my name, or my web design name because of crazy out-there ideas and no respect for my experience in this field, that web site will never go live, either because I can't bring myself to create one like that.

If I don't value my own work, and protect my own image, who the heck will? No one!

But I see the jam you're in and if you are really that against this site, could you possibly ask them to get someone else to do this since you weren't hired specifically as a web designer/developer?

I guess I'm trying to say avoid compromising your principles at all costs.

Originally Posted by fitnfree

That's precisely what I do -- but if I don't have my name, or my web design name because of crazy out-there ideas and no respect for my experience in this field, that web site will never go live, either because I can't bring myself to create one like that.

If I don't value my own work, and protect my own image, who the heck will? No one!

But I see the jam you're in and if you are really that against this site, could you possibly ask them to get someone else to do this since you weren't hired specifically as a web designer/developer?

I guess I'm trying to say avoid compromising your principles at all costs.

I have worked on some sites where I wasn't happy with the outcome, but the guy I built it for was absolutely thrilled with the out come...wouldn't change a thing. My name is no where to be found anywhere on the site.

I can't push it off on to someone else. It's just me and the boss man...I've been working for him for ~2 years and we have a great relationship. I would do the work for him for free if I had to...and I only have a few months left in college, and i'm really working hard to make an impact on my portfolio.

I'm pretty much just sucking it up and doing what he wants me to do..because after all, it is his company, not mine. Some of his ideas are good, some not so good. I take the good with the bad...He certainly isn't the only person i've encountered to nitpick at the little things..i'm just speaking in an overall generality.

Thank you all for your feedback

Well, it does sound like you're going to have to do this -- chalk it up to another experience. There's always something to be learned from situations like this and learning is never a waste. Good luck with the project!

I just realized the part where you said "manufacturer of products". As minor as that sounds, it's important.

Manufacturers, particularly manufacturers of industrial products, have to prepare different marketing materials. They have to look...well, "industrial" to appeal to their target market (usually a bunch of blue-collar people transplanted into white-collar situations who bring lunch-bucket thinking and tastes to the equation...not that there's anything wrong with lunch-bucket thinking.)

The reason you're probably annoyed is because they took away a lot of the artistic elements (or drastically altered them) associated with your work. That's not necessarily a bad approach, either...it's what industrial manufacturers are typically used to.

Take a look at industrial print marketing materials if you get the chance. They're generally pretty hideous and look like someone dug up an old copy of Publisher on a Win95 box and bashed away until they got something that "looked okay".

My wife does marketing and some web design. When I was putting together FreelanceLocalTech, I had another designer work on the logo (because she was too busy at the time being 9 months pregnant). I got a set of logo mock-ups from the designer and I liked one and she hated it. But I knew my target audience and she didn't. I flashed the logos to a bunch of freelancing buddies and they ALL liked the same one I did. So if she was the designer, just because she didn't like it, doesn't mean it wasn't perfectly correct for the site.

So... you advise your client (or boss) on what you think is right, but the client/boss always has the last word on what things should look like. You may know design, but you may not understand the target audience as well as the client/boss. And even if you do, you are there to offer advice. This is business, not personal.

If it gets personal, time to take up something less stressful.